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	<title>Comments on: Unique Visitors suck. That&#8217;s why we shouldn&#8217;t change the definition.</title>
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	<link>http://showmeanalytics.com/2009/03/unique-visitors-suck/</link>
	<description>Analytics from the Show Me State</description>
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		<title>By: Trending Upward &#124; More Great Analytics Resources</title>
		<link>http://showmeanalytics.com/2009/03/unique-visitors-suck/comment-page-1/#comment-172</link>
		<dc:creator>Trending Upward &#124; More Great Analytics Resources</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 May 2009 01:51:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://showmeanalytics.com/?p=50#comment-172</guid>
		<description>[...] up is showmeanalytics.com. You might know my opinion toward unique visitors and Angie&#8217;s last couple posts have been around this topic. Very interesting. I love the debate over unique [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] up is showmeanalytics.com. You might know my opinion toward unique visitors and Angie&#8217;s last couple posts have been around this topic. Very interesting. I love the debate over unique [...]</p>
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		<title>By: jake</title>
		<link>http://showmeanalytics.com/2009/03/unique-visitors-suck/comment-page-1/#comment-57</link>
		<dc:creator>jake</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Mar 2009 19:01:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://showmeanalytics.com/?p=50#comment-57</guid>
		<description>&quot;the Committee has tried very hard to make our definitions enlighten more than confuse&quot;

I don&#039;t think it&#039;s enlightening anyone to allow the vendors to label data as &quot;Unique Visitors&quot; when it is not in fact &quot;Unique Visitors&quot;. If someone else comes in and looks at an analysts numbers and sees differences between the vendors &quot;Unique Visitors&quot; and the numbers the analyst is reporting, that&#039;s extremely confusing, and fairly suspect too. Whereas, if they saw, &quot;First Party Cookies&quot;, &quot;Unique User ID&#039;s&quot;, and internal database reports put together to create a &quot;Unique Visitor&quot; metric, that would actually make some sense. Not to mention added value for the analyst! Look at what your analyst does for the company! He or she isn&#039;t just copy/pasting!

That&#039;s part of why so many organizations are taking such a long time to put on dedicated web analysts. We allow vendors to water down metrics so that they don&#039;t think they need a web analyst. They can just set up a dashboard in Omniture, schedule it to email out every week and that&#039;s good enough. 

&quot;And it is really up to the analyst to ensure that s/he understands what is being measured, and what is the best way to convey that to other stakeholders.&quot;

Aren&#039;t you giving an alibi to those analysts that do not use discretion in their use of Unique Visitors. By not explicitly labeling data correctly, that data is allowed to be used incorrectly. What if an analyst logged into their reporting tool and found no explicit &quot;Unique Visitors&quot; metric? I think that would be a far greater learning experience than just allowing the term to be misused endlessly.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;the Committee has tried very hard to make our definitions enlighten more than confuse&#8221;</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t think it&#8217;s enlightening anyone to allow the vendors to label data as &#8220;Unique Visitors&#8221; when it is not in fact &#8220;Unique Visitors&#8221;. If someone else comes in and looks at an analysts numbers and sees differences between the vendors &#8220;Unique Visitors&#8221; and the numbers the analyst is reporting, that&#8217;s extremely confusing, and fairly suspect too. Whereas, if they saw, &#8220;First Party Cookies&#8221;, &#8220;Unique User ID&#8217;s&#8221;, and internal database reports put together to create a &#8220;Unique Visitor&#8221; metric, that would actually make some sense. Not to mention added value for the analyst! Look at what your analyst does for the company! He or she isn&#8217;t just copy/pasting!</p>
<p>That&#8217;s part of why so many organizations are taking such a long time to put on dedicated web analysts. We allow vendors to water down metrics so that they don&#8217;t think they need a web analyst. They can just set up a dashboard in Omniture, schedule it to email out every week and that&#8217;s good enough. </p>
<p>&#8220;And it is really up to the analyst to ensure that s/he understands what is being measured, and what is the best way to convey that to other stakeholders.&#8221;</p>
<p>Aren&#8217;t you giving an alibi to those analysts that do not use discretion in their use of Unique Visitors. By not explicitly labeling data correctly, that data is allowed to be used incorrectly. What if an analyst logged into their reporting tool and found no explicit &#8220;Unique Visitors&#8221; metric? I think that would be a far greater learning experience than just allowing the term to be misused endlessly.</p>
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		<title>By: angie</title>
		<link>http://showmeanalytics.com/2009/03/unique-visitors-suck/comment-page-1/#comment-56</link>
		<dc:creator>angie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Mar 2009 17:50:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://showmeanalytics.com/?p=50#comment-56</guid>
		<description>Jodi, John, and Simon, thank you for your encouragement... much appreciated! 

Jake, the Committee hs tried very hard to make our definitions enlighten more than confuse... that has actually been one of our driving factors. We&#039;re not letting vendors redefine the data, we&#039;re merely reflecting how we as analysts use it. As a web analyst, I am in complete control of whether my tool vendor uses 3rd party cookies, 1st party cookies, or authenticated user IDs to measure unique visitors for my websites, and I choose different methodologies on different sites for different reasons. Because of this, I have to agree with what I think you&#039;re saying in point 3: UV is almost more of a concept since there are multiple ways to measure it, and they are often used in a hierarchical manner within the same tool and on the same website.  And it is really up to the analyst to ensure that s/he understands what is being measured, and what is the best way to convey that to other stakeholders. Thanks for your comments.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jodi, John, and Simon, thank you for your encouragement&#8230; much appreciated! </p>
<p>Jake, the Committee hs tried very hard to make our definitions enlighten more than confuse&#8230; that has actually been one of our driving factors. We&#8217;re not letting vendors redefine the data, we&#8217;re merely reflecting how we as analysts use it. As a web analyst, I am in complete control of whether my tool vendor uses 3rd party cookies, 1st party cookies, or authenticated user IDs to measure unique visitors for my websites, and I choose different methodologies on different sites for different reasons. Because of this, I have to agree with what I think you&#8217;re saying in point 3: UV is almost more of a concept since there are multiple ways to measure it, and they are often used in a hierarchical manner within the same tool and on the same website.  And it is really up to the analyst to ensure that s/he understands what is being measured, and what is the best way to convey that to other stakeholders. Thanks for your comments.</p>
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		<title>By: Simon Tu</title>
		<link>http://showmeanalytics.com/2009/03/unique-visitors-suck/comment-page-1/#comment-55</link>
		<dc:creator>Simon Tu</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Mar 2009 17:24:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://showmeanalytics.com/?p=50#comment-55</guid>
		<description>It is very clear that this article is by someone who is in the trenches, actually doing the work rather than throwing stones from the outside.

You have listed four things that Eric completely missed or deliberately ignored simply to make his point. Hopefully it was ignorance and not deliberate.

Unique Visitors measured by analytics tools are not People. But Unique Visitors  measured by panels are even worse. ComScore&#039;s panel for the United States is 180k People extrapolated to measure the behavior of 200 million &quot;people&quot; who use the web in the US. Are you sure ComScore / IAB / Eric understand what they are shoveling?

The Analytics industry has rapidly evolved in the last few years, it will continue to do so. It is admirable that the IAB has decided to join the party as well. Rather than mandating and yelling and personally attacking people lets try and collaborate and improve.

Thank you for bringing some rationality to the discussion Angie.

Simon Tu.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is very clear that this article is by someone who is in the trenches, actually doing the work rather than throwing stones from the outside.</p>
<p>You have listed four things that Eric completely missed or deliberately ignored simply to make his point. Hopefully it was ignorance and not deliberate.</p>
<p>Unique Visitors measured by analytics tools are not People. But Unique Visitors  measured by panels are even worse. ComScore&#8217;s panel for the United States is 180k People extrapolated to measure the behavior of 200 million &#8220;people&#8221; who use the web in the US. Are you sure ComScore / IAB / Eric understand what they are shoveling?</p>
<p>The Analytics industry has rapidly evolved in the last few years, it will continue to do so. It is admirable that the IAB has decided to join the party as well. Rather than mandating and yelling and personally attacking people lets try and collaborate and improve.</p>
<p>Thank you for bringing some rationality to the discussion Angie.</p>
<p>Simon Tu.</p>
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		<title>By: jake</title>
		<link>http://showmeanalytics.com/2009/03/unique-visitors-suck/comment-page-1/#comment-54</link>
		<dc:creator>jake</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Mar 2009 16:11:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://showmeanalytics.com/?p=50#comment-54</guid>
		<description>1. Do we really want the mouthpiece of web analytics (WAA) to be saying &quot;It may not make sense, but it&#039;ll be confusing if we change it, so it&#039;s going to stay the way it is&quot;. Real Progressive!

2. I&#039;m pretty sure Eric did not say we need to do a &quot;Find and Replace&quot; in all of our reports and replace &quot;Unique Visitors&quot; with &quot;Unique Cookies&quot;. He was saying that we should label data appropriately. By letting vendors (and the WAA) redefine data they are doing a disservice to the data consumers. On that point I will say the WAA is wrong. 

3. Unique Visitors won&#039;t exist. It&#039;s just not going to happen. It&#039;s a concept, not data. It is ingrained in Execs so it&#039;s still going to exist, but let the Analyst interpret the data how they need to. The vendor should present the data objectively. The analyst is the one that sprinkles their special sauce to make it relevant to whoever&#039;s reading the report.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>1. Do we really want the mouthpiece of web analytics (WAA) to be saying &#8220;It may not make sense, but it&#8217;ll be confusing if we change it, so it&#8217;s going to stay the way it is&#8221;. Real Progressive!</p>
<p>2. I&#8217;m pretty sure Eric did not say we need to do a &#8220;Find and Replace&#8221; in all of our reports and replace &#8220;Unique Visitors&#8221; with &#8220;Unique Cookies&#8221;. He was saying that we should label data appropriately. By letting vendors (and the WAA) redefine data they are doing a disservice to the data consumers. On that point I will say the WAA is wrong. </p>
<p>3. Unique Visitors won&#8217;t exist. It&#8217;s just not going to happen. It&#8217;s a concept, not data. It is ingrained in Execs so it&#8217;s still going to exist, but let the Analyst interpret the data how they need to. The vendor should present the data objectively. The analyst is the one that sprinkles their special sauce to make it relevant to whoever&#8217;s reading the report.</p>
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		<title>By: John Stansbury</title>
		<link>http://showmeanalytics.com/2009/03/unique-visitors-suck/comment-page-1/#comment-53</link>
		<dc:creator>John Stansbury</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Mar 2009 14:21:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://showmeanalytics.com/?p=50#comment-53</guid>
		<description>Angie,
Engaging and enlightening. Thanks for posting this. 
j</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Angie,<br />
Engaging and enlightening. Thanks for posting this.<br />
j</p>
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		<title>By: Jodi McDermott</title>
		<link>http://showmeanalytics.com/2009/03/unique-visitors-suck/comment-page-1/#comment-52</link>
		<dc:creator>Jodi McDermott</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Mar 2009 14:18:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://showmeanalytics.com/?p=50#comment-52</guid>
		<description>Angie,

You were able to say in thousands of words what I was trying to fit into the 400-600 word space that I had to work with.

Excellent post - you hit every point we&#039;ve discussed ad nauseum.

Thanks, Jodi</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Angie,</p>
<p>You were able to say in thousands of words what I was trying to fit into the 400-600 word space that I had to work with.</p>
<p>Excellent post &#8211; you hit every point we&#8217;ve discussed ad nauseum.</p>
<p>Thanks, Jodi</p>
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		<title>By: angie</title>
		<link>http://showmeanalytics.com/2009/03/unique-visitors-suck/comment-page-1/#comment-50</link>
		<dc:creator>angie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Mar 2009 11:51:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://showmeanalytics.com/?p=50#comment-50</guid>
		<description>Thanks Eric, I do appreciate that. I know the conversation has been... well... lively, and there are a lot of good points raised all around. And, yes, even the things we don&#039;t like to hear are brought back to the Committee for thoughtful consideration. There&#039;s just been a lot of talking *about* the Standards Committee, and not enough talking *to* the Standards Committee, and I&#039;m not sure people realize that coming to consensus about the metrics we use is a lot more involved than it looks. 

I can&#039;t count the number of times I&#039;ve read something in a post (not picking on you here, there are lots of examples) with the reaction &quot;But we talked about that, and chose to do it another way because... I wish they would have talked to someone on the Committee before posting.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks Eric, I do appreciate that. I know the conversation has been&#8230; well&#8230; lively, and there are a lot of good points raised all around. And, yes, even the things we don&#8217;t like to hear are brought back to the Committee for thoughtful consideration. There&#8217;s just been a lot of talking *about* the Standards Committee, and not enough talking *to* the Standards Committee, and I&#8217;m not sure people realize that coming to consensus about the metrics we use is a lot more involved than it looks. </p>
<p>I can&#8217;t count the number of times I&#8217;ve read something in a post (not picking on you here, there are lots of examples) with the reaction &#8220;But we talked about that, and chose to do it another way because&#8230; I wish they would have talked to someone on the Committee before posting.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Eric T. Peterson</title>
		<link>http://showmeanalytics.com/2009/03/unique-visitors-suck/comment-page-1/#comment-49</link>
		<dc:creator>Eric T. Peterson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Mar 2009 05:31:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://showmeanalytics.com/?p=50#comment-49</guid>
		<description>Angie,

Interesting post/rebuttal and you raise some good points. At this point I suspect it is best to &quot;agree to disagree&quot; about what a standard is, what a &quot;Unique Visitor&quot; is, and what the WAA Standard&#039;s Committee&#039;s response to the IAB &quot;re-definition&quot; should be. 

As I did apologize to Jodi I will apologize to you as well: I certainly could have left the WAA entirely out of my post and instead simply evangelized for what I personally believe to be a better, more useful, and more accurate set of definitions (those proposed by the IAB.)  I meant no disrespect to your fine work and efforts.

I wish you all the best,

Eric T. Peterson</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Angie,</p>
<p>Interesting post/rebuttal and you raise some good points. At this point I suspect it is best to &#8220;agree to disagree&#8221; about what a standard is, what a &#8220;Unique Visitor&#8221; is, and what the WAA Standard&#8217;s Committee&#8217;s response to the IAB &#8220;re-definition&#8221; should be. </p>
<p>As I did apologize to Jodi I will apologize to you as well: I certainly could have left the WAA entirely out of my post and instead simply evangelized for what I personally believe to be a better, more useful, and more accurate set of definitions (those proposed by the IAB.)  I meant no disrespect to your fine work and efforts.</p>
<p>I wish you all the best,</p>
<p>Eric T. Peterson</p>
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